I Told You So Molinism

Deuteronomy 7:3-4 Do not intermarry with them. Do not give your daughters to their sons or take their daughters for your sons, for they will turn your sons away from following me to serve other gods, and the LORD's anger will burn against you and will quickly destroy you.

1 Kings 11:2, 9
They were from nations about which the LORD had told the Israelites, "You must not intermarry with them, because they will surely turn your hearts after their gods." Nevertheless, Solomon held fast to them in love.... verse 9  The LORD became angry with Solomon because his heart had turned away from the LORD, the God of Israel, who had appeared to him twice.

God uses His middle knowledge to warn people. If you put yourself into a given circumstance, you will do this.  God knew what would happen if the Israelites intermarried.  He knew what the foreign wives would do and how the Israelites would respond.  Sadly, Solomon didn't listen.

On divine determinism, God's foreknowledge is logically "too late" to serve as a warning.  All  (even the hypothetical - if you intermarry, you will fall away) is determined by God.  So 1 Kings 11 turns into "I told you I determined you would fall" as opposed to "I told you you would fall".    

Comments

SLW said…
I told my kids not to hang out at parties where underage drinking was going on, because if they did, those underage drinkers would draw them into drinking and all kinds of unfortunate things would occur. Was I using middle knowledge?
December 5, 2012 at 11:10 AM
Godismyjudge said…
SLW,

Sort of. You could have been wrong, but God can't be wrong.

God be with you,
Dan
December 5, 2012 at 12:36 PM
SLW said…
What would it take for me to be right? It seems to me that if my kids thoughts and intentions were transparent to me I would be able to prognosticate their actions in given circumstances with near perfection, even though it couldn't be said that I knew what they would do by necessity.
December 5, 2012 at 3:19 PM
Godismyjudge said…
The probability of you being right would correspond to the probability of their performing the action. So if, given the causal forces at play in your kids nature and circumstances, there's a 90% chance they would do something, and you had all that data, then your odds of being right would be 90%.

If the odds go to 100%, then your kids wouldn't have libertarian freedom.

God be with you,
Dan
December 5, 2012 at 4:30 PM
SLW said…
Doesn't Molinism posit a 100% probability for God knowing what an agent with creaturely freedom would do in all possible circumstances?
December 5, 2012 at 5:28 PM
Godismyjudge said…
Yes, God can't be wrong.

God be with you,
Dan
December 5, 2012 at 7:20 PM
SLW said…
If that is the case, how can the Molinist position allow libertarian freedom, for God always prognosticates at 100%? When conditionals obtain his correctness is self-evident, when they do not, the prognostications become counterfactual statements which cannot be true because they represent less than that 100% probability which you said is God's standard.
December 6, 2012 at 12:16 AM
Godismyjudge said…
This is similar to simple foreknowledge. God knows with 100% certainty what the future will be (or would be), not because causal forces give a 100% probability for an event to occur, but in some other way.

God be with you,
Dan
December 6, 2012 at 12:02 PM
SLW said…
in some other way
Now there's the rub!

Incidentally, I just wanted to let you know how much I appreciate your tone and willingness to have me pick your brain.
December 6, 2012 at 2:28 PM
Godismyjudge said…
My pleasure and your right, that's the tough part. At some point you have to say "because He's God", and leave it at that.

God be with you,
Dan
December 6, 2012 at 8:57 PM
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